In all my (former) years of being a Christian I could never understand why God was considered a loving God, to me love is not blood and suffering. Love is not murdering your son to appease your own vanity. Love is not hatred or wrath, consigning billions of people to eternal torture because they have offended your ego or disobeyed your rules. Love is not obedience, conformity, or submission. True love is respect and admiration, compassion and kindness. True love is what God fails to show, even in Holy Scripture true love rarely shows its face. After growing up in a Christian household, God seemed like a abusive father, focused on installing fear in the hope I would always obey him, imposing immense amounts of guilt every time I did something against his will, striking me every time I disobeyed him. I am familiar with tough love, but God seems to have taken it a bit too far. If God really exists, I hope he isn’t even comparable to the God Christians put forth today. What's you opinion?
God and Love?
wow! very eloquent!
(the avatar is scary-cool, dude!)
Reply:that many people have different opinions but by far i support yours because it's well explains the relationship us Christians have with god and love. I even question my self sometimes! Report It
Reply:imagine a love that will allow you to do all the things you want, helping you in everything you do, a love without struggles in becoming perfect or creating something perfect... Gods love is justice and fairness. we actually dont have the right to question anything about God, the fact that he made you alive is enough reason for you to believe him and obey him... all the struggles and sufferings you have are just preparing you to be in Gods kingdom... i have asked him a thousand times of whys and what... though i dont get all the answers this questions made me think af the answer and search on my own....
Reply:If you created a creature and gave that creature the freedom to choose and that creature betrayed you wouldn't you be angry too? What right does a creation have to question the creator? The reason God is love is because as the creator he had no reason to not destroy his creation but he chose to even offer his creation eternal life for the sake of the few that chose to follow him.
Reply:My opinion is that the God of the Bible is not the only God in the Cosmos.
The Gods of many of the polytheistic religions are not like abusive parents. Perhaps you are being called in that direction......
Reply:God is not loving in any other way than the fact that he will save us from our torturous lives with a death and a invite to heaven.
Too bad he is a metaphor to help the poor people cope with not having the things the rich people have.....
Reply:If i cud shake your hand for the words you've wrote.What is the reason for all this is it merely some sick game for his veiwing pleasure?
Reply:I dont want to force my opinions on anyone, but I dont think there really was a god. Jesus walked earth but air was filled with SO much crap, people went delusional. Just like in scientology, bible was probably written by some dreamer, a writer with a wonderful and brutal imagination. That would be my opinion.
I think there might be SOMETHING watching over us, but i doubt it's interfering with our daily lives...
But lets say so many people ARE wrong, and god does exist, and all those things did happen, yes, he would be a very cruel god.
Reply:That God is merely a tool of the church to do exactly that, cause fear for dominance.
There is no God.
Reply:Humans are the ones who sin..God is perfect.. IT WASNT MURDER...HE WILLINGLY WAS CRUCIFIED SO WHEN we repent we can live again...you arent fit to judge God...obviously you arent born again.. Be sure to get some sun..
Reply:God means love, if we love each other that means we LOVE God
Reply:I agree with you. Well put!
Reply:Its funny you ask this question because I have been having trouble with understanding it. Recently I have found something that actually gave me greater comfort.
Could God prevent the tragedies? Yes, the Lord is omnipotent, with all power and control over our lives. But he will not. The same way I am not able to shield my child from disappointments, temptation, sorrow, or suffering.
This is our free will to develop for us to choose carefully, and grow in our faith.
"No pain we suffer, no trial that we experience is wasted. It ministers to our education, to development of such qualities as patience, faith, fortitude,and humility. All that we suffer and endure, especially when we endure it patiently, builds up our characters, purifies our heart, expands our souls, and makes us charitable, more worthy to be called the children of God.... and it is through sorrow and suffering, toil and tabulations, that we gain the education that we come here to acquire and which will make us more like our Father in heaven...." by Orson F. Whitney
Reply:another one of those common questions people thinking they are smart ask after they see it on the web. i remember seeing on this on some comedian's show, forgot his name.
i use this analogy:
do parents not love their children?
but if their child was to go commit murder, rape people, rob banks, won't the parents punish their child and let him go to juvi, or would they go, oh i love him, despite him raping and murdering he deserves to be set free?
well if your parents are like that, then i can understand why you asked this question.
(btw im not proving or defending god, im just saying stupid teens watching tv shows and looking up google, let the more muture and intellectual athiests argue their points)
Reply:I'm a very practicising catholic but I find you should ask those questions. But you should ask them with humility and without a doubt on faith.
There is no bigger love than to give his own live for others.
Love are not only words but love is the most profound reality of our life. So love can't be only with actions of the mouth but it has to be with all our existence.
The Martyrs have made love of their lifes.
And so did all the apostels. (John was also martyrized but didn't die by that.)
That's what God asks from us. He doesn't want love to be an external attribute of us but a deep reality in our life.
His Son is the example so he asked the same for him.
But you are really right. It is a bad manner of some christian sects to speak allways of the punishment of hell.
The bible recognices the reality of hell to give importance to our decision but not to make us fear.
If you know that hell exists you are more free with your will. You don't fear the punishment of your senses and you can choose what is the real truth by rational thinkings. Our senses often fight against the spirit the thinking of hell helps us against those forces to be free in our decision.
@shiafiul
Yes, the person you are speaking about has now seen that the Islam is a religion of hatred and want to come back to the true faith. But it's not possible. The muslim kill everybody who follow the free decision of faith.
Reply:Sherry Hamblen - My Journey to Islam
Stories of the New Muslims
When I was small, going to church was a major event. First, I got to wear a fancy dress with frills and bows and more often than not it was itchy! I tried my best not to fidget in it. At Vacation Bible School there was a craft! And then.. the event of all events, the snack!! Wow, served on a colored paper plate with a napkin. I would look at the pictures of Jesus on the walls and think about him, for I was told that the blonde, blue-eyed Jesus was God. The western Christian idea of God was firmly implanted, along with the snack.
As I grew I tried hard to maintain my religion. When my parents divorced, I went to church alone. When the Pastor said that reading the Bible brought you closer to God, I read it. When he said prayer was the key, I prayed. Even as a kid I ached in my heart for God.
I ended up marrying a man who was to become a Pastor. I continued reading the Bible, and praying, and aching in my heart. I concentrated on rearing my children and keeping the house and yet in my heart I ached for God so much. Something was not right.
I began to think.
That's when the “trouble” began. I got the bright idea that I would read the Bible through and in one shot get all my questions answered. I ended up reading it more than once, and didn't get my questions answered! Why did God favor David so much when he committed adultery, and had Uriah killed? Gee I didn't do that and.. felt God was far away. Jesus was God, I was taught; and yet.. there is a story where this man comes up to Jesus and calls him "good master", and Jesus replies asking “Why callest thou me good? There is none good but One that is God.” Now why would God say that?? I had many other questions besides this. I started asking my questions, and got into trouble. I was told I had no faith, and I was messing in details of no concern. Nothing was making sense!
The true turning point came after revival one night. I was exhausted from over an hour of singing, and at the dinner table my husband was going over the fine points of his sermon. I had questions and asked them and he erupted in an angry tirade. I went outside crying and again felt that ache in my heart that I was so familiar with. I talked to God. I told him I didn't know Him, but I wanted to so very much. I told Him I had done all that I knew to do. I asked Him to reveal Himself to me no matter what it took, or what I had to lose. I had to find God.
Eruptions at home were becoming commonplace. The Pastor's wife must not confide her troubles to anyone in the church! Gossip and much trouble can start that way. To have someone to talk to I began going into Christian chat rooms. One day in that room I met a muslim. Tarek was the first Muslim I had ever met. I had to win him to Jesus! Tarek was a little unnerving because he seemed to sense my discontent. I was trying very hard to lead him to Jesus and show Tarek I had the truth, and he wasn't buying it. That day began a relationship that was a war of words. We wrote for months; I sent him my objections to Islam, and he answered with facts. When Tarek sent articles on the fallacies in the Bible, I would cringe. Many of them I had already studied; but more? Back and forth we went. Things at home and at church were escalating at a dizzying pace. I could no longer sit on the front pew of the church in the honored Pastor's wife position and open my Bible in the same way. Things were now tainted with questions. Answered questions.
At this time in my life I was in a well, so to speak. I couldn't read the Bible with the same zeal anymore; I wasn't sure if my prayers were right; church was a big fiasco as far as I was concerned because I could no longer tell what was the truth and what wasn't. Tarek started telling me to read the Quran and issued me a formal challenge! I thought it over for a couple of days as if I did this I would have to make a major effort and I had to face the possibility of conversion. Part of me was also desperate for God by this time. Church was becoming more and more painful. At this time I was missing song services as I could no longer sing the songs. The words bothered me so, the emotionalism in the people that got us no where. Everything was coming into clarity and it was very, very frightening as I was the only one seeing things this way. When you are on the platform or on the first row of the pew you can't hide spiritual discontent! Many times during the sermon I would hear something I knew to be false and I just couldn't take it I would get up and walk out. What a sight, me leaving and walking down that long center aisle out the door in plain view of the whole church.
I now had to get a copy of the Quran. The library had one, but it was gone. No bookstore around had a copy. That left one place that I knew of , and that was ISNA (Islamic Society of North America)!! I had heard from Christians that there were snipers on the roof who shot at people who trespassed! I went anyway I was so desperate for God and there I met Habibe. She talked to me for a long while and was very sweet. Not only did I get a copy of the Quran but she also gave me prayer books , general books and pamphlets. Tarek had sent me some studies and a beautiful picture of a star nebula that I printed off and before that evening I had read all the pamphlets. I made a mistake though; I left my studies on the couch where my husband found them. He threw them and the picture of the nebula in the fire and yelled that I was bringing Satan into the home. He said if he found my Quran he would roast it either in the oven or in the fire and I hid it. He tore up the house looking for it. I began planning my day so I would come home when he left, and leave when he came home. For the week we might see each other for only 15 minutes or so. My marriage was nearly over. The rest of the time I was studying or in my favorite spot in the forestry where I would cry and talk to God.
One Friday I went to the mosque for prayer. I sat on the side and the first time I heard the Azzan I cried. I felt relaxed there for the first time in months. What was happening to me??
I was reading the Quran every day. Things were coming into sharp focus. The view of God in the Quran is very different from the Biblical God. This God made sense. At this time some of the leadership at church approached me to be president of a chapter of a nationwide women's organization. One of the "outreaches" of this organization is to lead Muslim women out of Islam and into Chrisitianity! I had just met Habibe.. she didn't needed converting! She was more together than any woman I knew at church! I told them tentatively that I was not the one for this job when they told me God had told them (and God had spoken to the statewide people too) that I was the one! Wow ! So now I had God “against” me. I told them I would preside over the first few meetings and the first meeting was packed with many women. I led the song service, and spoke very neutrally. I actually just spent my time on empty verbage as I couldn't talk a Christian message.
Then I read the Quran some more and something clicked. That was it. I quit song service and presiding over the women's group. I attended mosque and quit attending church. One night when I didn't expect my husband to come home, he did. After a violent outburst I asked him to leave the house and surprisingly, he did. Things began unraveling. My family was so upset at what I was doing; my marriage was over; the church couldn't believe what had happened, and news travels fast in a small town. I had to set my face for anything just to go to the store. Still I searched! News began to fly that I had become a Muslim. I hadn't pronounced my Shahadah (testimony of faith) yet!
I told Tarek that all my questions were answered except one: about the diety of Jesus. I remembered Sunday School and being so afraid of not accepting Jesus right because he was the only way to God, you see. Tarek didn't send me a lot at this time actually only two concentrated studies. I printed them and studied. In one study, 1 John 5:7 was said to be an addition to the text, not an original verse. That verse became my Ace.. if that verse was in question, then I had to admit Jesus may not be God. I went to the State Library and did some research. I found that the information was correct, that this verse was indeed in question. I sat in the library for a long time in a daze.
I went home and admitted to God that He was God alone. There was no one beside him. Instead of being struck with lightning I felt peace! People in the town would approach me and say things, but I had a peace I had never had before. The town printed my divorce in the paper. I read a book on Tawheed and made my decision to take my Shahadah. One night I admitted to God that He was One and Only God and Mohammed was the messenger of God. I had no doubts as I had studied through every single one. That night I prayed my first prayer, Fajr. I was broken as circumstances were very difficult for me, as my family was upset and not accepting to say the least. After my prayer with my head on the floor I talked to God about everything and I knew He heard me. I knew it! I can't tell you what that was like for me, it was as if I had been in a thirst so deep my throat was burning fire and then I had a cool drink of healing. It was everything I had ever wanted from God all wrapped up in a few moments of time.
Since then I have had to move, and had to deal with staples in my tires from angry people who are blaming all Muslims for September 11th; I have been yelled at, spit at; my family is still not accepting. This is small compare
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